| Biblical grounds of faith or Christian conversation on religion between a Catholic and a Protestant Christian, written as one hundred and forty questions and answers as requested by pious hearts, to present clearly and Scripturally the difference of religion for the simple, by a confessor of the truth, a miner who was banished for the sake of the Gospel, Joseph Schaitberger |
| The Catholic Greatly beloved brother! During our journey and travels, we have discussed many worldly things; now let's talk about God's Word and about the Christian religion, for we should look to things eternal above all else, and learn how we can live Christianly and die blessedly. The Protestant That is good, dear travel-companion, and pleases me indeed, that you have come to this thought, for I prefer to speak of spiritual than of worldly things, especially when it works to God's glory and to the edification of our Christianity. When it happens however only out of curiosity and ambition, often squabbling and disunity results, and it is much better if we remained quiet, for through useless questions God is insulted and people angered. 2 Tim 2:13, Tit 3:6 The Catholic No, dear friend! Let us not squabble and argue, but conduct a Christian conversation with each other, for I indeed hope, that we are brothers in the faith! But first of all, forgive me, I must ask, of which faith are you? Lutheran or Catholic? The Protestant Why do you ask about my faith? I trust that I will be saved in it. For I believe, what the prophets announced, what Christ preached, and what the apostles have written. In short, I am certainly old apostolic-catholic. Acts 24:14 The Catholic I like hearing that from you, and I like you all the more, for I am also Catholic and believe, what the Pope and the Roman-Catholic church teaches and believes, whether it stands written in the Bible or not. The Protestant Now, dear friend! That I don't believe. You must understand me aright: in this way we are not brothers in the faith, for I am certainly old Roman-apostolic-catholic; you, however, are new papal- catholic, and for this reason note well what I say: I am indeed truly catholic, but you are such only by the outward name. Rom 1:8, 2 Tim 3:5 The Catholic Why do you call yourself a Roman Christian, but aren't, as I hear according to your own confession, committed to the Roman church or to its teaching about the faith? Were you born in Rome, like the apostle Paul? Acts 22:27-28 The Protestant No, I wasn't born in Rome, and am not committed to the Roman-papal teaching about the faith, but rather my faith is built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, since Jesus Christ is the corner- stone, Eph 2:20, and the beautiful epistle, which Paul wrote to the Romans, that I hold as my best foundation in the faith, and for that reason I properly call myself an old Roman Christian. Rom 3:24, 28 The Catholic All my life I have heard much said about the Lutherans, and I would like to know, what they really do believe in their religion. So then tell me, what is the foundation of your Protestant-Lutheran faith? Show me; I want to hear. The Protestant What we Protestant Christians believe in our religion, that I want to prove to you thoroughly and clearly from the Holy Scriptures. Hear then: first of all, we have in our Protestant church the true, old, and common six main points of Christian teaching, to start with the old and holy Ten Commandments of God, Ex 20:3. Secondly, we have also the true, old, apostolic Christian faith, Rom 1:8. Thirdly, we have also the true, old and holy prayer, the Our Father, Mt 6:9. Fourthly, we have the true, old and spiritual ecclesiastical office, the keys to heaven, to forgive penitents their sins, Jn 20:23. Fifthly, we have the true and old Christian baptism, Mt 28:19. Sixthly, we have also the true, old and holy Lord's Supper in both kinds, as Christ himself instituted, Mt 26:26. See our catechism The principal elements which we have in our Protestant church have been taught and believed from the time of the apostles onward for five hundred years. After that time, though, the principal parts were completely darkened by the Roman popes and through the Councils. Then our dear God finally sent the pious Martin Luther, who once again taught us and preached the pure Gospel The Catholic Why then did Martin Luther stand down from our Catholic church and teaching of the faith? It would have been far better, if he had let things lie, then not so much disunity would have resulted. The Protestant Luther instigated no disunity, but he only wrote against idolatry, and punished papal abuses. He did not stand down from the old and apostolic, but from the new and papal church and its teaching of the faith, and Bishop Matthias of Salzburg quite rightly asked, if our priests had been of use, then Luther wouldn't have written against them The Catholic I won't like having much more to do with you, for I think you believe in Martin Luther. The Protestant No, I don't believe in Martin Luther, and wasn't baptised into him, for he was a man, just as I am. However, what he taught and wrote, that wasn't the teaching of human beings, but divine truth, and agrees in all articles of the faith with the Holy Scriptures clearly and obviously The Catholic Now tell me too: where was correct faith and the true church before Luther's time? for God has always had on earth a Christian church, in which people have been able to be saved. The Protestant Even if in Luther's time the Roman papacy stood in the greatest idolatry and had no visible church for a long time, like the Jews in Elijah's time, Rom 11:4, God nevertheless still maintained an invisible church in the midst of the dark papacy, in which people have been able to be saved, for they still had holy baptism. See Doctor Pfeiffer's old Lutheranism The Catholic Whoever simply believes will also simply be saved. For the common man can't understand the Holy Scriptures. The Protestant What is useful for people to know regarding salvation, that is easy and clearly to be understood from the Scriptures; even young children can grasp and comprehend it, 2 Tim 3:15-16. So you can't excuse yourself before God through your ignorance, Acts 20:23, Mic 6:8 … The Catholic Listen, a good friend said to me recently, that though he had spent a lot of time amongst the Lutherans, he had nevertheless neither seen nor heard much good from them. He had met many who cursed and swore but very few pious Christians had he found. And therefore I can't acknowledge your faith as good. The Protestant Dear friend! The Christian church is like a field, in which grows not only good wheat but also weeds, Mt 13:27, 30. You have to look at whether the teaching is true, and not at the life. Listen, aren't there also amongst you Catholics more bad than good Christians? Who can change that? Have patience; God will in his own time weed the garden, Tit 1:15. The Catholic I would still like to know, whether you Protestants or we Catholics have the true faith? Therefore I say, by what does one recognise the right saving faith? The Protestant Wherever one preaches the pure Word of God and nothing else, and distributes the holy Lord's Supper according to the command of Christ in both kinds, there is the true Christian church and the right saving faith; that is the best sign, but you won't find suchlike amongst you Catholics, 1 Cor 11: 26. See Johann Spangenberg The Catholic That is another thing I don't like with you: they say, the Protestants despise the holy Virgin Mary, the mother of God and say, she is no better than any other common woman. The Protestant No, you can't in truth say that about us, for how could we despise the pure Virgin Mary, whom God himself designated as his mother, Lk 1:26. We esteem the Virgin Mary, and celebrate her days according to ancient custom, but that we should worship her next to God, like you do, for that we have no commandment in the Holy Scriptures. For it says, we should worship God and serve him alone, Mt 4:10, Ps. 50:15. The Catholic Now I would also like to know how many sacraments you have in your Protestant church? The Protestant We have no more than two sacraments, holy baptism and the holy Lord's Supper which Christ himself instituted, Mt 25:26, Mk 16:16. The Catholic I am far ahead of you in terms of numbers, for we have seven sacraments. The Protestant That is impossible to believe, think about it more. Perhaps you have made a mistake and have counted one for two, for three times two plus one, that makes seven. The Catholic No. I haven't over calculated for we have 1) baptism, 2) the Lord's Supper, 3) confirmation, 4) confession, 5) last unction, 6) ordination, 7) marriage. The Protestant Listen, you idiot! How can you have seven sacraments? You aren't an ordained priest, and it surprises me that the clerics hold marriage as a sacrament but don't themselves take wives! I believe that they have to be taking the unmarried cook for a wife, as often happens, for otherwise they can't have seven sacraments The Catholic Pardon me that I ask once more: can your pastors exorcise devils from possessed people? The Protestant Of course that has happened often. But thank God that Satan doesn't have as much power over us Christians in the Protestant church who have the true faith as he does over you Catholics. Listen, the fact that so many people are possessed by the Devil amongst you is because of unbelief and idolatry. For Satan has his kingdom amongst the children of unbelief, Eph 2:2. The Catholic Whether we according to your opinion have the true faith or not, I hope anyway that you won't damn all of us catholic Christians. The Protestant No, I won't damn all of you; I hope the best for the pious and the simple, who know nothing better of the will of God, for if they penitently regret their sins, and die trusting in Christ alone, they can of course be saved, Mt. 20:9, Lk 23:34. The Catholic What do you say then of those people, who read your books and who recognise in the Protestant faith divine truth, but who nevertheless remain in the catholic faith as hypocrites because of temporal considerations? Can they also be saved? The Protestant Such people I don't want to judge or damn, Lk 6:37, but commend to God and pray diligently for them, for it is dangerous for them if they don't leave the papacy, for no one can serve two masters, 2 Cor 6:14, 17, Mt 7:24. However, the blind papists who maliciously curse and persecute Protestant Christians, I can't declare them saved; they will find their judge, Jn 15:22, Jn 12:48 The Catholic You are causing me to doubt my faith, and if it is all true, what you have told me up to now, then I would prefer to be Protestant than to remain Catholic. The Protestant That is good, dear friend! I would have great joy in your conversion, for whoever turns his neighbour from the false way to the truth, he has helped a soul from death, Jas 5:19-20. The Catholic I believe God sent you to me, just like Philip was sent to the Ethiopian eunuch, to convert me, Acts 8: 5, 35-38. The Protestant May God bless you! We will soon end our conversation on the road, so read diligently the Bible and Luther's large catechism, and so will you find that our Protestant teaching of the faith agrees clearly and thoroughly with the Holy Scriptures in all points. The Catholic Listen, how long did the true, old apostolic church remain pure in its teaching of the faith after Christ's Ascension? The Protestant Five hundred years, after that the popes and some of the bishops of the Christian church began to introduce and set going human commandments and statutes. The Catholic Tell me in closing: around what time and through which people were so many new commandments set going in the Roman-papal church? The Protestant The dark of night is approaching, I don't have much more time to speak with you, but because of love I will show you clearly and thoroughly in concluding, who did it. Listen, Pope Felix introduced the last unction in the year 530 |
| Be ready at all times to give an answer to every one, who demands from you the grounds of the faith. 1 Peter 3:15 |
from Book Three:
| JOSEPH SCHAITBERGER SENDBRIEF |
